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Discontinuity in student preparedness?

Economist
7387

I've been a prof about 10 years at a nonselective regional college. Taught in grad school (100+ program on Repec, so nothing special) during the Great Recession, and was a lecturer briefly in the mid-aughts.

Is it just me/my institution, or have the rest of you also experienced a very sharp decline in student quality/preparedness/whatever-you-want-to-call-it this term? The 21-22 year wasn't great, either, but this seems considerably worse to me. Maybe it's just my institution, though?

Thanks in advance for your perspectives.

2 months ago # QUOTE 14 Volod 1 Vlad !
Economist
fa1b

US top 70 PhD granting department in a large state school. Yes, I have noticed a sharp drop off as well in average grades for my upper division courses. This is accompanied by an even more bi modal distribution. I still have a cluster of good students, but the rest are now just abysmal with no students in between.

2 months ago # QUOTE 3 Volod 1 Vlad !
Economist
7387

Thanks for the feedback!

Glad you still have your cluster. I have maybe 1 of every 40 students who are decent (not "good", just decent). Used to be closer to 10-20% of any given class.

2 months ago # QUOTE 2 Volod 0 Vlad !
Economist
5be2

At my state school I have noticed a significant decline over the last 10 years. I dont really know how bad the decline has been in the last two years because of the change in modality.

2 months ago # QUOTE 2 Volod 0 Vlad !
Economist
4015

It used to that students rarely received special accommodations (academic, medical, mental health, etc). Now it seems quite frequent in every class I teach. Students either contact the dean’s office to get an accommodation letter, or failing that they whine to me about their problems (sometimes after missing two weeks of class because they’re “under too much stress” and the like).

2 months ago # QUOTE 7 Volod 0 Vlad !
Economist
fd0d

Lost COVID years + Diversity admissions

Enjoy.

2 months ago # QUOTE 12 Volod 0 Vlad !
Economist
8c2d

The TikTok, video games, and Internet pron generation. They have goldfish attention spans and no motivation to study

2 months ago # QUOTE 8 Volod 0 Vlad !
Economist
5eee

This is happening everywhere. Even at good schools, half of the students are irredeemably incompetent and cannot solve even basic problems.

It's not just in business and econ:

"Half of Quebec nursing students fail September licensing exam ... the exam was unchanged for the last couple of years. The preceding exam, in March 2022, had a 71 per cent success rate, while the exam in September 2021 had an 81 per cent pass rate."
https://globalnews.ca/news/9278800/quebec-nursing-exam-complaints-probe/

2 months ago # QUOTE 5 Volod 0 Vlad !
Economist
5eee

Lost COVID years + Diversity admissions

The TikTok, video games, and Internet pron generation. They have goldfish attention spans and no motivation to study

Social media, video games, and accessible corn have been around for decades.

Covid school closures and a strong push for diversity admissions are more recent.

Secondary education is also in free fall.

2 months ago # QUOTE 6 Volod 0 Vlad !
Economist
7387

This is happening everywhere. Even at good schools, half of the students are irredeemably incompetent and cannot solve even basic problems.
It's not just in business and econ:
"Half of Quebec nursing students fail September licensing exam ... the exam was unchanged for the last couple of years. The preceding exam, in March 2022, had a 71 per cent success rate, while the exam in September 2021 had an 81 per cent pass rate."
https://globalnews.ca/news/9278800/quebec-nursing-exam-complaints-probe/

Thank you. I was not aware of this evidence. I knew about the U.S. NAEP data, but that's kids that haven't made it to us yet.

2 months ago # QUOTE 0 Volod 0 Vlad !
Economist
7387

At my state school I have noticed a significant decline over the last 10 years. I dont really know how bad the decline has been in the last two years because of the change in modality.

If it wouldn't give away too much, about how selective is/was your school? Admissions rate or SAT/ACT score-speaking, that is.

2 months ago # QUOTE 0 Volod 0 Vlad !
Economist
8af4

Lost COVID years + Diversity admissions

The TikTok, video games, and Internet pron generation. They have goldfish attention spans and no motivation to study

Social media, video games, and accessible corn have been around for decades.
Covid school closures and a strong push for diversity admissions are more recent.
Secondary education is also in free fall.

accessible corn hasn't been around for decades. sex in mainstream media in general used to be so taboo that a video game having some inaccessible code the simulated ridiculous polygonal sex (gta san andreas hot coffee) was a prime time news scandal. far easier to find depraved pron on all mainstream sites, 24/7 available to due the proliferation of smartphones and streaming. you used to have to download a 300mb video all afternoon on some borderline 56k set up. totally different level of accessibility

2 months ago # QUOTE 0 Volod 2 Vlad !
Economist
cf0a

It used to that students rarely received special accommodations (academic, medical, mental health, etc). Now it seems quite frequent in every class I teach. Students either contact the dean’s office to get an accommodation letter, or failing that they whine to me about their problems (sometimes after missing two weeks of class because they’re “under too much stress” and the like).

Yeah, there are a bunch of generational differences like that. Students do seem to expect to be catered to a lot more.

A sizable chunk of students seem to feel that typical things that students all have to deal with like learning something you don't already know, working hard for an assignment or exam, getting a mark lower than you hoped for, or sometimes even just coming to class, are real moral affronts that should be apologized for and undone as much as possible.

I am not sure how much I have seen the discontinuity the OP speaks of. Maybe a little bit as a result of the return to normal from the pandemic. A lot of faculty had an attitude along the lines of "don't worry about it, it's a pandemic." That peaked at the beginning of the pandemic, but I think a lot of us eased out of it gradually, so each semester was stricter than the last. That means there are always going to be students somewhat justifiably saying "I could have gotten away with this nonsense I am trying to pull last year."

2 months ago # QUOTE 5 Volod 0 Vlad !
Economist
4015

I had several students contest an A-minus grade. And in an impertinent way, like “I deserve better than this! You should grade!”

I mean, phuk you.

getting a mark lower than you hoped for

2 months ago # QUOTE 3 Volod 0 Vlad !
Economist
4015

*raise my grade

2 months ago # QUOTE 0 Volod 0 Vlad !
Economist
8ed3

The absolute collapse of west is inevitable.

The question is, what place to move to

2 months ago # QUOTE 0 Volod 0 Vlad !
Economist
43d7

meanwhile in China...

The absolute collapse of west is inevitable.
The question is, what place to move to

2 months ago # QUOTE 0 Volod 0 Vlad !
Economist
78e1

Lost COVID years + Diversity admissions

The TikTok, video games, and Internet pron generation. They have goldfish attention spans and no motivation to study

Social media, video games, and accessible corn have been around for decades.
Covid school closures and a strong push for diversity admissions are more recent.
Secondary education is also in free fall.

accessible corn hasn't been around for decades. sex in mainstream media in general used to be so taboo that a video game having some inaccessible code the simulated ridiculous polygonal sex (gta san andreas hot coffee) was a prime time news scandal. far easier to find depraved pron on all mainstream sites, 24/7 available to due the proliferation of smartphones and streaming. you used to have to download a 300mb video all afternoon on some borderline 56k set up. totally different level of accessibility

lol dude people have been cranking it to internet porn for generations

2 months ago # QUOTE 0 Volod 0 Vlad !
Economist
e5a7

Yes. At a state flagship teaching in the business school. Roughly top 10 US news for MBAs. This isn’t meaningful for research but it is typically an accurate ranking of student quality. This is the first year we haven’t required the GMAT and the decline is incredible. People can’t do basic 6th grade math, let alone pert.

I've been a prof about 10 years at a nonselective regional college. Taught in grad school (100+ program on Repec, so nothing special) during the Great Recession, and was a lecturer briefly in the mid-aughts.
Is it just me/my institution, or have the rest of you also experienced a very sharp decline in student quality/preparedness/whatever-you-want-to-call-it this term? The 21-22 year wasn't great, either, but this seems considerably worse to me. Maybe it's just my institution, though?
Thanks in advance for your perspectives.

2 months ago # QUOTE 3 Volod 0 Vlad !
Economist
e5a7

Undergrads are pretty much the same though? I had them last 2 years though, and they were junior finance majors.

2 months ago # QUOTE 0 Volod 0 Vlad !

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