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• Thread: 511 Goods vs 141 No Goods

1. Economist
   7cc9
   

   I'm an AP (tenure track). I genuinely care about things like reducing inequality and discrimination, but I'm also not a crazy wokester. I'm dedicated to truth, reason, logic, and science, and the whole woke thing blows my mind.
   I know there is a silent majority like me in academia that is afraid of speaking up out of fear of losing job not getting tenure. To my like minded colleagues, I'm curious, how are you nativatigating interpersonal interactions when this crap comes up? Luckily, I've been able te dodge much of this working remotely, but when we go back soon, I'm worried about what's to come...

   I find it works really well for me.
   -- RP

   Yes, Prof Pande, you have done a great job of pretending to care about less fortunate people and used that to deflect attention from your "research"

   2 years ago # QUOTE 4 Volod 0 Vlad !

2. Economist
   7b6c
   

   Non-tenured people should not have opinions. Keep your head down, bro.

   Patently silly. And I say this as a tenured faculty member.

   Then you haven’t seen much in your career. Non-tt people routinely lose their entire academic careers for getting on the wrong side of a tenured prof or an admin.

   This should be a huge warning sign for anyone considering academia

   Nah, that's sil/ly. All jobs are like this. Don't antagonize the power structure.

   2 years ago # QUOTE 2 Volod 0 Vlad !

3. Economist
   b7c6
   

   You need to learn to milk it. Look at people like Seema or Panda. They talk all the time about how they are empowering women, serving the poor. And get paid d@mnded well for doing it. A lot easier than doing real research

   1 year ago # QUOTE 1 Volod 1 Vlad !

4. Economist
   b76f
   

   Leaving the USA.

   Basically this. This isn't a problem only in academia at this point. It is encountered everywhere, and in every walk of life. It is debilitating and very unpleasant.

   At this point, it is no longer worth living in the US (and several other countries where this is happening).

   I realized this was happening, and was going to get a lot worst, already back in 2016. I made the decision already back in 2016 that I was going to leave the US for good. Once I have saved enough money (which should be soon), I am leaving and never coming back. Life is too short to live in an insane asylum.

   1 year ago # QUOTE 1 Volod 1 Vlad !

5. Economist
   6bfe
   

   and go where? doesn't seem to be any alternative.

   1 year ago # QUOTE 3 Volod 1 Vlad !

6. Economist
   bce6
   

   Hwite Male non-tenured AP here. I have few simple principles to survive in my wonky (even for the current standards) department:
   1) Do not interact with women at all. No student advising, no chats at the department with female faculty member, unless directly asked for sth.
   2) If asked I have no opinion on any controversial issue. I would simply say I dunno or I did not have time to think about it.
   3) I stopped going to seminars given by minority or women, simply because I was afraid my comment will be misinterpreted. I got my PhD from one of the midwest programs quite famous for brutal seminars, so I kind of inherited this attitude.
   4) If I can I avoid all diversity, bias etc. workshops. Some of them are mandatory so I would attend not paying too much attention, but pretending to be careful listener.
   5) I never, ever post anything controversial on my social media or I never say anything like that during class. I minimize non-formal interactions with students. I stopped going for happy hours being afraid I might say sth inappropriate after a beer or two, whcih would then get reported.

   Well, you can see it kind of kills a lot of good stuff, but what choice do I have? It's not like there are tones of jobs for so so hwite dudes in academia.

   1 year ago # QUOTE 5 Volod 1 Vlad !

7. Economist
   1413
   

   Hwite Male non-tenured AP here. I have few simple principles to survive in my wonky (even for the current standards) department:
   1) Do not interact with women at all. No student advising, no chats at the department with female faculty member, unless directly asked for sth.
   2) If asked I have no opinion on any controversial issue. I would simply say I dunno or I did not have time to think about it.
   3) I stopped going to seminars given by minority or women, simply because I was afraid my comment will be misinterpreted. I got my PhD from one of the midwest programs quite famous for brutal seminars, so I kind of inherited this attitude.
   4) If I can I avoid all diversity, bias etc. workshops. Some of them are mandatory so I would attend not paying too much attention, but pretending to be careful listener.
   5) I never, ever post anything controversial on my social media or I never say anything like that during class. I minimize non-formal interactions with students. I stopped going for happy hours being afraid I might say sth inappropriate after a beer or two, whcih would then get reported.
   Well, you can see it kind of kills a lot of good stuff, but what choice do I have? It's not like there are tones of jobs for so so hwite dudes in academia.

   Associate Prof here from MRM. I do the same thing. Be a low key, bow to all these PC and diversity demands, avoid any contact with women and minorities just in case. At least at my dept we go once a month for a beer with my colleagues, all hwite males, seniors and juniors across fields. There we just let the steam off. And honestly we discuss strategies how to navigate through all these traps. Before the job market season we always coordinate and proceed together against diversity/minority/wmen candidates. And there is a simple reason, it is in our vested interest, we do not want to become extinct at our dept and we want to keep our group strong. They have no mercy, neither do we!

   1 year ago # QUOTE 2 Volod 1 Vlad !

8. Economist
   5ca9
   

   So many co/wards in this thread, jesus F-ing c/hrist. You guys deserve to be slaves to b/atsh!t crazy wokes. At least they are not co/wards.

   1 year ago # QUOTE 0 Volod 2 Vlad !

9. Economist
   1413
   

   So many co/wards in this thread, jesus F-ing c/hrist. You guys deserve to be slaves to b/atsh!t crazy wokes. At least they are not co/wards.

   They have no mercy, neither do we. We play at their field, according to their rules, and use all tools we have. Do not blame us, we just defend what we have.

   1 year ago # QUOTE 1 Volod 0 Vlad !

10. Economist
    04ef
    

    I've doubled down on my oppression of minorities.

    LOL GELD THIS

    1 year ago # QUOTE 0 Volod 0 Vlad !

11. Economist
    b44d
    

    Hwite Male non-tenured AP here. I have few simple principles to survive in my wonky (even for the current standards) department:
    1) Do not interact with women at all. No student advising, no chats at the department with female faculty member, unless directly asked for sth.
    2) If asked I have no opinion on any controversial issue. I would simply say I dunno or I did not have time to think about it.
    3) I stopped going to seminars given by minority or women, simply because I was afraid my comment will be misinterpreted. I got my PhD from one of the midwest programs quite famous for brutal seminars, so I kind of inherited this attitude.
    4) If I can I avoid all diversity, bias etc. workshops. Some of them are mandatory so I would attend not paying too much attention, but pretending to be careful listener.
    5) I never, ever post anything controversial on my social media or I never say anything like that during class. I minimize non-formal interactions with students. I stopped going for happy hours being afraid I might say sth inappropriate after a beer or two, whcih would then get reported.
    Well, you can see it kind of kills a lot of good stuff, but what choice do I have? It's not like there are tones of jobs for so so hwite dudes in academia.

    Associate Prof here from MRM. I do the same thing. Be a low key, bow to all these PC and diversity demands, avoid any contact with women and minorities just in case. At least at my dept we go once a month for a beer with my colleagues, all hwite males, seniors and juniors across fields. There we just let the steam off. And honestly we discuss strategies how to navigate through all these traps. Before the job market season we always coordinate and proceed together against diversity/minority/wmen candidates. And there is a simple reason, it is in our vested interest, we do not want to become extinct at our dept and we want to keep our group strong. They have no mercy, neither do we!

    Typical MRM attitude. You see the same thing with truck drivers, public-school teachers, factory workers, and other union-driven professions. Protectionism hurts quality of output and only helps individuals who would be better off in other lines of work.

    1 year ago # QUOTE 0 Volod 1 Vlad !

12. Economist
    b76f
    

    and go where? doesn't seem to be any alternative.

    There are a lot of alternatives.

    1 year ago # QUOTE 0 Volod 0 Vlad !

13. Economist
    b44d
    

    and go where? doesn't seem to be any alternative.

    There are a lot of alternatives.

    I’d suggest packing your bags and moving to Afghanistan, where their adherence to monoculturalism and traditional values would appeal to you.

    1 year ago # QUOTE 1 Volod 0 Vlad !

14. Economist
    1413
    

    Hwite Male non-tenured AP here. I have few simple principles to survive in my wonky (even for the current standards) department:
    1) Do not interact with women at all. No student advising, no chats at the department with female faculty member, unless directly asked for sth.
    2) If asked I have no opinion on any controversial issue. I would simply say I dunno or I did not have time to think about it.
    3) I stopped going to seminars given by minority or women, simply because I was afraid my comment will be misinterpreted. I got my PhD from one of the midwest programs quite famous for brutal seminars, so I kind of inherited this attitude.
    4) If I can I avoid all diversity, bias etc. workshops. Some of them are mandatory so I would attend not paying too much attention, but pretending to be careful listener.
    5) I never, ever post anything controversial on my social media or I never say anything like that during class. I minimize non-formal interactions with students. I stopped going for happy hours being afraid I might say sth inappropriate after a beer or two, whcih would then get reported.
    Well, you can see it kind of kills a lot of good stuff, but what choice do I have? It's not like there are tones of jobs for so so hwite dudes in academia.

    Associate Prof here from MRM. I do the same thing. Be a low key, bow to all these PC and diversity demands, avoid any contact with women and minorities just in case. At least at my dept we go once a month for a beer with my colleagues, all hwite males, seniors and juniors across fields. There we just let the steam off. And honestly we discuss strategies how to navigate through all these traps. Before the job market season we always coordinate and proceed together against diversity/minority/wmen candidates. And there is a simple reason, it is in our vested interest, we do not want to become extinct at our dept and we want to keep our group strong. They have no mercy, neither do we!

    Typical MRM attitude. You see the same thing with truck drivers, public-school teachers, factory workers, and other union-driven professions. Protectionism hurts quality of output and only helps individuals who would be better off in other lines of work.

    We are only defending what we have and we respond to incentives. The cohesion of our group is as important to us as is the cohesion of their group for wonkers. And besides, we are not so bad researchers, always few top 5 pubs per year in our group. MRM may mean for example top 30-70, so do not talk about quality of output here.

    1 year ago # QUOTE 2 Volod 0 Vlad !

15. Economist
    b76f
    

    and go where? doesn't seem to be any alternative.

    There are a lot of alternatives.

    I’d suggest packing your bags and moving to Afghanistan, where their adherence to monoculturalism and traditional values would appeal to you.

    And I'd suggest you go eat a bag of Ds.

    1 year ago # QUOTE 0 Volod 0 Vlad !

16. Economist
    e932
    

    I've doubled down on my oppression of minorities.

    Have no you or anyone else tried to fail one?

    They show up fifteen minutes late and some lay their head on the desk (the black men)
    It still makes me feel like a failure.

    1 year ago # QUOTE 1 Volod 1 Vlad !

17. Economist
    1a90
    

    Hwite Male non-tenured AP here. I have few simple principles to survive in my wonky (even for the current standards) department:
    1) Do not interact with women at all. No student advising, no chats at the department with female faculty member, unless directly asked for sth.
    2) If asked I have no opinion on any controversial issue. I would simply say I dunno or I did not have time to think about it.
    3) I stopped going to seminars given by minority or women, simply because I was afraid my comment will be misinterpreted. I got my PhD from one of the midwest programs quite famous for brutal seminars, so I kind of inherited this attitude.
    4) If I can I avoid all diversity, bias etc. workshops. Some of them are mandatory so I would attend not paying too much attention, but pretending to be careful listener.
    5) I never, ever post anything controversial on my social media or I never say anything like that during class. I minimize non-formal interactions with students. I stopped going for happy hours being afraid I might say sth inappropriate after a beer or two, whcih would then get reported.
    Well, you can see it kind of kills a lot of good stuff, but what choice do I have? It's not like there are tones of jobs for so so hwite dudes in academia.

    I do this as well in my department. But, I work on gender differences, so I'm surrounded by wokesters at conferences. However, I have cultivated a complete indifference to the political orientation of my hypotheses. Rather, I indulge a taste for clever ironic comparative statics results in my research. If I hear ideological comments that might be fun to overturn, I make a careful note and try to figure out if there is a significant literature supporting this false belief. By keeping about 20+ of these sorts of hypotheses in mind, I'm able to eventually find a few that I can make a clean test for. These become the core of papers. In writing these papers, I especially relish repurposing woke terminology to subtly undermine it. Then, when I meet big name woksters, I will discuss my evidence to get their reaction. Some times, the reactions,e.g., from Pandhe is mild outrage, but even then, she gave some useful comments, which I learn from to improve my paper and further bolster my evidence.

    1 year ago # QUOTE 0 Volod 0 Vlad !

18. Economist
    b44d
    

    and go where? doesn't seem to be any alternative.

    There are a lot of alternatives.

    I’d suggest packing your bags and moving to Afghanistan, where their adherence to monoculturalism and traditional values would appeal to you.

    And I'd suggest you go eat a bag of Ds.

    I avoid Doritos because they are unhealthy. I don’t enjoy covering my face in Cheeto dust, either, unlike you.

    1 year ago # QUOTE 0 Volod 0 Vlad !

19. Economist
    b76f
    

    I've doubled down on my oppression of minorities.

    Have no you or anyone else tried to fail one?

    I stopped trying after the first year. After that, just give them Ds...and they are usually satisfied with that grade and don't raise problems.

    They show up fifteen minutes late and some lay their head on the desk (the black men)

    They show up?

    1 year ago # QUOTE 0 Volod 0 Vlad !

20. Economist
    c0b0
    

    Tenured bro here. I grab 'em by the pvssay.

    1 year ago # QUOTE 0 Volod 0 Vlad !

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