Look, you seem like a really nice department, but don't you think your female students should have some female role models?
https://business.vanderbilt.edu/our-school/faculty/finance/
(this is intended for all departments that look like this)
Some departments really need women
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*face palm*
I have, in many capacities (undergrad student society, faculty), been at orientation events trying to attract students to consider econ majors. I ask the reluctant ones why they aren't considering economics. The females frequently say that it is because they don't see any female faculty.
I tried to convey this sentiment to department chairs at my various institutions and they were always defensive about their lack of female representation.
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*face palm*
I have, in many capacities (undergrad student society, faculty), been at orientation events trying to attract students to consider econ majors. I ask the reluctant ones why they aren't considering economics. The females frequently say that it is because they don't see any female faculty.
I tried to convey this sentiment to department chairs at my various institutions and they were always defensive about their lack of female representation.That just means other depts. have more female students.
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Female here. Here is my perspective, be nice with your no-gooding. When I was in the market, I had a couple interviews with all male econ departments (of non-trivial size). I am in econ, which may be a little less male heavy than finance, so it's not a direct comparison.
It wasn't a massive deal to me, but after I noticed it, it definitely struck me. I would be a little wary about being the only female in a department with 10+ males. It could be totally fine, or it could make me a bit of a token/outsider. Having a 50-50 gender split doesn't matter to me, I would be approximately equally comfortable if females were anywhere between 25% and 75% of my colleagues.
I am not trying to act outraged, but I think my view is fairly common. My guess is that a lot of females would have a mild aversion to being the only female in the department (assuming it is not a tiny faculty, of course. If it were 1 female and 2 or 3 males, it would be much less of a big deal).
I feel less strongly about it from students' perspectives. The vast majority of interactions is with one faculty member at a time, so the overall composition of the department is less salient. I couldn't tell you the gender composition of the faculty at any school I attended (albeit it was never 0% female), but I can give you a pretty good estimate of the gender composition of any school I worked at.
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I have, in many capacities (undergrad student society, faculty), been at orientation events trying to attract students to consider econ majors. I ask the reluctant ones why they aren't considering economics. The females frequently say that it is because they don't see any female faculty.
Imagine you taught somewhere in the rural south. When try to recruit students, you found that some were avoiding the econ department because there are black faculty members, and they feel uncomfortable around black people. Should the econ department hire fewer blacks? Or would you instead advise the students to grow up?
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Suppose that students view female faculty members as less competent ceteris paribus and give lower evaluations to female instructors. Therefore you get more majors and higher teaching evaluations if you have male faculty. Is that a reason to hire fewer women? Or would it make more sense to take a principled stand against discrimination?
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Solid research means corrupted officials do wonders for the bottom line of corrupting firms . And?
Look, arguments that good researcher are being discriminated against on some basis and therefore lost to science are important. That females need to be represented because they are females, because we need female role models or because females feel uncomfortable in male majorities are not.
Should I start a campaign because all my colleagues are hetero and. Gay and gay students need gay role models? Should I start a campaign because I'm the only extreme left wing person in my department and I feel 'uncomfortable'? Should we also have black role models? Disability role models? Asian role models? Down syndrome role models? Divorcees role models? Bestiality role models? Nazi role models? Communist role models? Should every department reflect exactly the diversity in a society? Who defines what that diversity is? Why is it only among gender lines which, for better or for worse, face much less issues than minorities?
Let's talk about good researchers being lost and at what stage.
^Solid research shows that gendered role models indeed matter a lot.
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Solid research means corrupted officials do wonders for the bottom line of corrupting firms . And?
Look, arguments that good researcher are being discriminated against on some basis and therefore lost to science are important. That females need to be represented because they are females, because we need female role models or because females feel uncomfortable in male majorities are not.
Should I start a campaign because all my colleagues are hetero and. Gay and gay students need gay role models? Should I start a campaign because I'm the only extreme left wing person in my department and I feel 'uncomfortable'? Should we also have black role models? Disability role models? Asian role models? Down syndrome role models? Divorcees role models? Bestiality role models? Nazi role models? Communist role models? Should every department reflect exactly the diversity in a society? Who defines what that diversity is? Why is it only among gender lines which, for better or for worse, face much less issues than minorities?
Let's talk about good researchers being lost and at what stage.^Solid research shows that gendered role models indeed matter a lot.
You claim "arguments that good researcher are being discriminated against on some basis and therefore lost to science are important." That is exactly what happens when you have no female role models. Due to a lack of role models, there are less brilliant female people entering the profession, who are then lost to science.
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Female here. Here is my perspective, be nice with your no-gooding. When I was in the market, I had a couple interviews with all male econ departments (of non-trivial size). I am in econ, which may be a little less male heavy than finance, so it's not a direct comparison.
It wasn't a massive deal to me, but after I noticed it, it definitely struck me. I would be a little wary about being the only female in a department with 10+ males. It could be totally fine, or it could make me a bit of a token/outsider. Having a 50-50 gender split doesn't matter to me, I would be approximately equally comfortable if females were anywhere between 25% and 75% of my colleagues.
I am not trying to act outraged, but I think my view is fairly common. My guess is that a lot of females would have a mild aversion to being the only female in the department (assuming it is not a tiny faculty, of course. If it were 1 female and 2 or 3 males, it would be much less of a big deal).
I feel less strongly about it from students' perspectives. The vast majority of interactions is with one faculty member at a time, so the overall composition of the department is less salient. I couldn't tell you the gender composition of the faculty at any school I attended (albeit it was never 0% female), but I can give you a pretty good estimate of the gender composition of any school I worked at.This. Just imagine being a fresh 30 year old AP and the rest of faculty being 10 40 to 50 year old women some of whomever are probably experiencing a mid-life crisis.
Doesn't sound fun to me.
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I am a male LRM AP originally from Korea. I had flyouts to places in Utah and Indiana as a rookie. Departments looked like the one OP posted. Predominantly white male. It was hard to connect to the faculty. I didn't want to join them. I ended up in a coastal city.